Brian Jewell (00:01.518)
All right, everybody, my guest today is a MODOC tourism professional and enrolled citizen of the Klamath tribes with extensive experience in stewardship and indigenous tourism. After spending time advising various tribal destinations, she helped launch a DMO in southern Oregon and then later became a consultant with the Karagio Group. Today, she serves as education and business development director at the American Indigenous Tourism Association, where she works to unify stakeholder voices.

and promote sustainable tourism destinations. so close. And promote sustainable tourism development for native communities. Danielle Tehama, welcome to the podcast.

Dawnielle Tehama (00:42.072)
Thanks for having me, Brian. It's great to be here.

Brian Jewell (00:44.382)
I am so glad to have you here. You and I have kept in touch for two or three years now after doing some work together at an event a few years back, and I always enjoy a chance to get to talk to you. We talked about your background as a tribal member, but tell me how you got involved in the tourism aspect of tribal work.

Dawnielle Tehama (01:07.022)
So really good question. So my journey in indigenous tourism was really about relationship building and of course my own personal connection to indigenous communities. like you said, I am an enrolled member of the Klamath tribes from Southern Oregon. I currently reside in the state of Oregon, but working in and around the tourism space and the small business space, found myself surrounded by incredibly resilient, creative communities who were telling their own stories on their own terms.

And I wanted to be part of amplifying that. So really once you experience the depth of culture and the generosity and the living history that is indigenous tourism in our communities, you don't want to walk away from it.

Brian Jewell (01:50.858)
Yeah, I totally understand that. And what a fulfilling thing it must be to be able to do the work of tourism, which is fun for all kinds of people in all kinds of settings, but also do it in a way that uplifts a people group that you're a part of and is very close to you. That has to be very special.

So give us a sense, you I know you come from this group in southwest Oregon and that's where you live, but give us a sense of the breadth. If we look at the United States in general and the, you know, the variety of groups that you represent at the association, how diverse is the Native American community when it comes to tourism? What are the sort of different things that travelers can and should be hoping to experience when they visit those areas?

Dawnielle Tehama (02:39.726)
So the American Indigenous Tourism Association, were formerly IANTA, which was the American Indian Alaska Native Tourism Association, but we are the national nonprofit. So our former name, IANTA, really didn't fully encompass Native Hawaiians. So we do represent all the Native Hawaiian, Alaska Native Indigenous communities in the United States. And really what we do as an association is to

promote and support tourism across these tribal nations. We are the only national DMO for this. We are a 501c3 national nonprofit governed by an all-native board of directors that oversees specific regions. So we have regions that are identified to kind of help the voices be magnified. But people are often really surprised to learn that there are 575 federally recognized tribes in the US alone. And that doesn't even count state-recognized nations.

Alaskan communities, like I said, the native Hawaiians, we're talking about distinct languages and ceremonies, art forms and full ecosystems. for example, a Navajo experience in the Southwest might look, and it does not mind, it does look a lot different than a Tlingit experience in Southeast Alaska or Haudenosaunee experience in upstate New York. The diversity is genuinely staggering. so we're tasked with trying to help the traveler identify

how to have a culturally authentic, non-performative experience. We don't want to just say, hey, put on this costume and do this thing for a group when it's actually regalia and it's something that's very near and dear to us. And often there's a story, there's a ceremony, there's a purpose for everything that we're doing and the why behind it. really what we're tasked with in this organization is supporting those indigenous communities.

with telling their own story while maintaining their sovereignty.

Brian Jewell (04:40.532)
Yeah, that element of trying to avoid performative experiences, I think is so critical. Do you find that a lot of travelers from the buyer end, as it were, are looking for that performative experience or are they really open to something that's much more meaningful and authentic?

Dawnielle Tehama (05:02.095)
And that's where the education comes in. So I think travel planners and designers don't know what they don't know, right? So I think they often go seeking that performative experience and that same exact experience they had a month ago or a year ago. And that's really just not how it works. So the education to them to say, is a living culture. This is not something that's

just in textbook or black and white photos, we are a living culture. And so you can come and think beyond the gift shop. We're talking about guided Canyon hikes with tribal Rangers or stargazing on reservation lands or tribal lands with zero light pollution. Like I said, living history demonstrations, artists, studio tours, canoe journeys that go back to original indigenous place names, or just touring through ancestral lands and understanding.

the creation story of the tribe you're coming to visit. So I think travel planners, when they do their homework, they can build itineraries that are genuinely transformative and not just checking a box. So we try to build those bridges and create resources and have the available websites for these designers and travel planners to be able to expand their product. And there's a positive economic impact for them in that as well.

Brian Jewell (06:19.688)
Yeah, absolutely. Everything you named there just sounds incredible to me. And I can't help but think it's very different than just going to museum, arousing a gallery or going to some, I don't want to be too critical, but some performative, you know, dinner thing where people come out and do some routine that they've done every night for the past, you know, 15 years. Give us some more examples of some of those very cool and very authentic experiences that travel planners ought to be on the lookout for.

regardless of what part of the country they're going to.

Dawnielle Tehama (06:52.079)
So I know people are familiar with the term powwow, right? Not all tribes have powwow. But if there is a tribe in a destination that does powwow and it's around the time of year you're going, those are absolutely worth experiencing. They're celebrating, they're welcoming to visitors, and the regalia and the drumming. It's unlike anything else, really. It's the heartbeat of our nation. So there's tens of thousands of people who visit.

public experiences like that, like powwows and like other ceremonies every year. And a lot of tribes host cultural festivals as well, like market days or harvest celebrations. And just doing your research and also reaching out to some of our websites and our research can help you ahead of time because some ceremonies are private. And that is a boundary that deserves respect. So that goes back to, again, education. If you're having a family dinner at Easter,

wouldn't want a group of people coming in because they don't celebrate Easter, but they want to see how you do. Right. So, so there is, there's a definite line between what is welcoming and what is open to visitors like, like a powwow or certain ceremonies or certain gatherings. And then what needs to be respected as a cultural experience just for tribal members.

Brian Jewell (08:07.262)
Yeah. Is there sort of a rule of thumb for knowing which side of that boundary a certain experience or event falls on?

Dawnielle Tehama (08:17.006)
The best rule of thumb is to reach out to the tribe itself, right? So you want to be direct and you want to go to the source. A lot of times these days, the DMOs and the state have a really great relationship with the tribal nations, but you always want to defer to the tribe you're visiting itself, right? Their website, their calendar events, their cultural programming or their cultural department will have all of that information. And again, destinationnativeamerica.com, selfless plug there.

That is the consumer facing website that has resources on tribal locations, artisans, powwows, events. And it is curated as an all indigenous community resource. So every dot on the map, and it is an interactive map, every dot is an authentic indigenous run experience. So whether you want to find an indigenous property, like a lodging property or a restaurant, or if you're looking for a powwow, that's a great resource. But again,

All of those links also go back directly to those tribes because again, we want to make sure that we're perpetuating the story and the history of that tribe.

Brian Jewell (09:26.974)
Yeah. So maybe if somebody has read something in a magazine article a couple of years back or they're referencing a third party source, they probably need to check it with the authorities, you know, on the ground who actually know, you know, who can speak for the tribe itself rather than go on secondhand information.

Dawnielle Tehama (09:45.378)
Right, exactly.

Brian Jewell (09:46.856)
Yeah, cool. So something that I don't hear enough people talk about when they talk about indigenous tourism is experiencing native culture through its cuisine, which maybe I'm just biased. That's really how I love to travel. Share with us some of the culinary experiences people should know about that maybe got, you know, go beyond like fry bread, which is amazing. But but it's just like an entry point, right? So

Dawnielle Tehama (10:10.735)
Yes.

Brian Jewell (10:14.228)
What kinds of foods and food experiences should people be getting excited about?

Dawnielle Tehama (10:18.531)
I think you're a secret foodie, Brian. But you're absolutely right. But did you know that there's the frybread variations all across the US? some of us put milk and eggs, some of us use leavening, some of us is just flour and water and lard, very simple. So depending on where you are, the frybread is going to be different as well. So that's definitely something else to remember. But this is actually one of my favorite underrated topics.

Brian Jewell (10:20.426)
It's not much of a secret

Brian Jewell (10:30.034)
Yeah, see, I didn't even know that.

Dawnielle Tehama (10:46.861)
So indigenous cuisine globally is having a renaissance right now. Chefs like Sean Sherman have brought Ojibwe cuisine onto the national stage. We actually just honored a native chef at our last AITC. You can also find private competitions at powwows, bison and wild game tastings, depending on where you're visiting and where you're going. A lot of tribal restaurants do have the specific

Cultural fusions on their menus or things that are traditionally served Like we my tribe a few years back had one of the chefs in a competition and he brought duck and Plum wine to the menu and people would not think that that you know How did this native nation have plum wine? Well, there's four varieties of wild plum from where my community's from so

we utilize the resources of the land at the time. And so to have this modern twist on a traditional food kind of opens your ideas or opens your minds. It opens your mind to what the possibility of bringing those traditions modern day can be. Traditional corn preparations, for example, that predate European contact. To have the opportunity to taste some of these flavors,

or visiting an Alaska native village and having foods like salmon prepared with techniques that have been passed down for thousands of years. Food is always a doorway to culture. I think that's the big takeaway, but be open-minded to taste foods that you didn't know existed pre-colonial, right? But also in the way that they're prepared, the palette changes and it really does encourage you to.

to take a little risk and prepare things at home in a way that you now know is possible because of that cultural exchange when you visit these nations.

Brian Jewell (12:46.814)
Yeah, I love that. Do you have some examples of those pre-colonial foods? That's just a fascinating idea to me.

Dawnielle Tehama (12:53.773)
Yeah. So for example, like, like I mentioned with, with the Modoc, like the plum wine, they would actually take duck and, and, fuse it with the plum wine to kind of a marinade, right? Because wild duck, especially can be a bit gamey. So how do you, how do you break down and, and, and use that? Or, if you've been to Hawaii, like poi is a very, very common food, but my tribe also uses wokas root in a similar way to pound it, similar to,

different Asian cuisines with mochi, right? So using roots and creating different versions of carbohydrates. My in-laws are Hopi from the desert Southwest, right? It's kind of like the donut hole. The Navajo Nation is the Hopi Nation. And still grinding corn. Like my girls learned how to grind corn when they were young and using that blue corn meal to create Piki, which is a paper thin bread using corn meal on an extremely hot stove. So

understanding these traditions and how you can use that peaky, which is shelf stable through winter months, through fasting times, which is there's a health benefit for fasting that we as a modern day are recognizing now, but how to, how to keep things preserved and, also how to use one food in several different, several different plates. So how to prepare it differently. I don't know if that answered your question, but, pre-colonial. Yeah. So there's, you know,

blue corn versus regular corn meal. You see that masa versus corn, right? In the, South America, that is pre-colonial to have the masa flavor. It's very different than modern day corn on the cob. It's mass produced, right? So you're talking about heirloom seeds and heirloom traditions for harvesting these foods and understanding the agricultural aspect of bringing this food front and center as part of the highlight of a meal.

and really communing over that meal, is another big part of it. Indigenous communities like to feed you. We want to welcome you in. So come hungry because typically you're going to be eating three or four different houses if you come to visit during a ceremony. But we want to be able to come in and commune and talk to you. There's traditionally no phones. There's no iPads. There's no computers. There's no interruptions. It is just communing over a meal, which I think society loses track of sometimes. So maybe unplug.

Dawnielle Tehama (15:20.153)
Go to a local restaurant or go visit a tribal nation during a salmon bake and remember what it means to share a meal with friends and family at the end of a long day.

Brian Jewell (15:30.866)
Yeah, I love that. That's so human. It's so universal, the idea of let's sit down and share a meal together. And that could be especially, I don't know, helpful or even healing in this context we live in together where our history together has had some pretty dark times. So could you just kind of speak honestly with us about, you know, what it's like for people from Indigenous

nations to receive visitors from, you know, colonial groups and how we do that in a way that is human and is uplifting and universal and we all avoid making the wrong steps.

Dawnielle Tehama (16:16.331)
That's a really good question. I think historical tension, right, how we relate to travelers and visitors today, think it's really important to be honest, first and foremost. There's a lot of historical traumas and a lot of individual interpretations of what a historical trauma might be. But there is history there. And Indigenous communities get to decide how they engage with the visitor and with the traveler coming through the traveling public.

But what I find remarkable in this context is that so many communities have chosen tourism as a vehicle for reclaiming their narrative. We know that by reclaiming that narrative, we have tourism happening with us, not to us. Right? There should be nothing with us without us, nothing for us without us. And so understanding that, that it's an act of generosity in some regard, right? It's not selfish.

but it is an act of generosity. Visitors who come with humility and curiosity are almost always welcomed very warmly. And again, a lot of our websites have opened to the public events and ceremony that people can visit. The tensions arise when people treat Native culture like a museum exhibit rather than a living community. And we talked a little bit about that already. So when you come, come humbly and realize that something that looks like it hasn't been lived in in a century,

might still have someone's auntie or grandma living there, you know, it might be, or it might be a traditional ceremonial home, right? There's only visited certain times of the year. So understand that when you're being welcomed into a land, these are sovereign nations. So it's not like the neighborhood down the road or the community across the street. This is a sovereign, independently governed nation that you're visiting and know you don't need your passport to come in.

We do have tribal IDs and tribal regulation and a completely different set of laws that the state does not recognize or the county doesn't recognize because we are federally recognized oftentimes. But just be mindful that you are being welcomed in. We do want you to come and visit. We do want to educate you on who we are as a people, as a nation, as a community. We want to share our food and our culture, but just be respectful when you do come and be honest with yourself that

Dawnielle Tehama (18:38.337)
It hasn't been all rainbows and roses. There has been some historical tension and I think just recognizing that upfront puts you leaps and bounds ahead. Just being willing to be respectful and open-minded.

Brian Jewell (18:41.332)
Right.

Brian Jewell (18:52.946)
Yeah, I can imagine there may be some people out there who are hearing us talk and say, so many of these experiences sound amazing. The food sounds amazing. Learning about the culture sounds amazing, but I'm a little nervous or I think people in my group may feel a little nervous that if they go and visit these people, they're going to be made to feel guilty. They're going to be sort of beat over the head with, you know, ugly things in the past from, from a long time ago. Is that a valid fear? Is it?

an invalid fear and how do we handle that, especially those of us who are leading other people into travel experiences.

Dawnielle Tehama (19:28.547)
That's you're coming with some great questions today, Brian. I will say that, again, do your research. There are some museums that have very adult content in them, but you're warned ahead of time. And there's other there's other communities that are like, you know, what's done is done. We learn from the past and we move forward. And I think tourism can make that positive difference. But being educated, like if you were traveling to another country, you wouldn't just blindly grab your passport necessarily.

mean, some of us might, but you wouldn't blindly necessarily grab your passport, enter in another country without understanding the food, the culture, the currency, where you're going to stay and how you're going to get there. So consider, even though it's in, it's in the U S these communities, if they have museums and cultural centers, it's a fabulous way to learn the history. last week I was in Carson city and, and, our CEO Sherry Rupert used to head up the Stuart Indian school there.

And we just toured the museum as a team, part of our team anyway, last week. And they did a fabulous job of having the timeline of Stuart Indian School. And residential schools is another part of our history. The majority of it is very, very dark. Stuart did a fabulous job of highlighting the timeline of when students were brought, how families struggled with losing their children.

when they wanted to visit, where they had to camp near the school in order to be closer to their children, but also full circle moment, understanding that this is a learning point in our history as a country. This is not just tribal history, this is United States history. So where you're going, understand what the cultural interpretation is, if you're not ready for the complete black and white version.

Make sure that you're going to visit the cultural center and that the cultural center, which on tribal lands typically here's the history of who we are. Here's our dialect, where it came from. Here's how we're educating our children. Here's how we protect our elders. And you'll get to understand the family unit that is an indigenous community. We do not have posters and billboards when you enter tribal lands that talk about residential schools, genocide, trail of tears, what have you.

Dawnielle Tehama (21:48.813)
That's not who we are. We want to make a positive difference and we want to make sure that we're creating programs and jobs for our communities that otherwise could be lost. And we want to protect those restorations of century old adobe structures and our communities and our dialect so that that living history continues on in future years.

Brian Jewell (22:11.144)
Yeah. Talk to me about ways that you have seen tourism make a really positive impact on some of these communities, because I think for many of us who believe in the power of travel, that's a huge part of why we love this work we do. So tell us some stories about how you've seen that happen.

Dawnielle Tehama (22:28.003)
So I mentioned the Pueblo in New Mexico, tourism funding restoration of centuries old pueblos, right? So a lot of communities have foundations. so whether or not you're pro gambling, casinos and gambling is part of, casinos aren't necessarily part of our historic culture, but gambling is. We always traded, we bartered, we always had some type of game and that is part of our culture.

Now it's blown up to casinos. Not all tribes have casinos and not all tribes are pro-gamble, but the revenues from those casinos often fund those community foundations. Those community foundations, thanks to tourism, thanks to people stopping through, whether it's staying at a property, visiting a casino, going to museum, staying in an RV park, recreating on lands, buying a permit to hunt or fish on tribal lands. All those tourism dollars

go back to fund things that otherwise would be lost. Like I said, creating jobs and allowing our young people to stay in their communities rather than leaving for other cities, that's huge. And when it's done right, tourism becomes a tool for cultural perpetuation, not just economic development. But a thing that I want to lean in a little bit deeper on, a lot of us, especially in the US, that are aware of policy around DMOs and lodging tax,

Those lodging tax dollars do not benefit tribal nations because of our sovereignty status. So tourism on tribal lands actually goes back to fund our own police, our own fire, our own schools, our own road maintenance. So everything you're lodging tax or your, your, your, your tax that you're paying back to your County for the home that you live in, those tax dollars stay with you. We have to generate our own version. So when you're,

on tribal lands, you're supporting generational education, generational benefits, elders programs, youth scholarship, just the sky's the limit. Economic development for some tribes is very minimal and that's okay. And then there's others like the Navajo Nation or Seminole with Hard Rock. Hard Rock is a huge world renowned name, right? Everyone knows that. And that is tourism in action right there.

Brian Jewell (24:50.43)
Yeah. Talk to us more about how we can be part of those positive economic contributions. know, staying in a hotel off the tribal land is not going to bring in any revenue to the tribe. So are there nations that have their own hotels that, you know, benefit them economically? Or are there ways that people can get those dollars not only into, you know, indigenous hands, but even, you know, really deep down into, you know, those micro entrepreneurs in the nations themselves?

Dawnielle Tehama (25:20.769)
Yeah. So, by local and by direct, I will say that that's, that's with any small business, right? So keep that mindset, but staying in tribally owned lodges. if you're coming to visit Indian country, if you're coming to visit a tribal nation, tribally owned restaurants do exist just like the lodges. They're not all tied to casinos. There's a lot of standalone. but book tours run through tribal enterprise. If you're buying art or jewelry,

Make sure it's native-made, right? So ask the artist information. When it becomes duplicative, you're actually depleting the opportunity for those artists to support themselves and their families. So, know, Indian Arts and Crafts Act protects against fake native-made goods. Make sure you understand that it's authentic before you buy. Every dollar spent in community has a multiplier effect that outside businesses

can't quite comprehend because it's so siloed. But those are just, you know, again, some opportunity to contribute economically. Visit us if you're an outdoor recreation person. Come get a permit and do dispersed camping and hiking on our tribal lands. If you like to fish, even if you're a catch and release, buy a fishing license and come and visit tribal lands. You'd be surprised at the beauty that's out there that's really untouched and untapped.

Keep in mind, some nations do require you to have a guide if you're out in the wilderness. And part of that is because it's expensive to come and save you. But also, we want you to respect and have a knowledge of the environment that you're going into and how to responsibly and regeneratively visit those lands.

Brian Jewell (27:01.748)
Yeah, absolutely. I'm thinking of some itineraries that I've been on and similar trips like that where let's say in the Southwest, for instance, New Mexico, you might fly into an Albuquerque or a Santa Fe and then later the itinerary is going to, you know, go visit, you know, the Taos Pueblo or something similar to that. When I'm in that gateway city, there's going to be a dozen galleries and shops that are selling

Native jewelry or so they claim and it's rather expensive Later on in the trip when I visit the actual tribal lands. I'm gonna have an opportunity to buy something that's very similar maybe for Much less price is there a way that you would suggest people go about making that decision? That's gonna be more beneficial to the tribe directly

Dawnielle Tehama (27:51.023)
I would say ask the purveyor, right? If you're in, again, coming from Reno, we did go to the gift shop at Stewart Indian School because they do have one. But if you're in a gateway city shop, like a souvenir store, other retailer near a native destination that sells indigenous looking goods, ask them, is this authentic? Who did you buy from? Because they will typically know or

They'll have an information card with the item. A lot of tribal members will put their name, their tribal affiliation, sometimes their enrollment number on an FAQ card with that piece. So if you're looking at a little bit of a different angle trying to address like how a traveler can avoid or spend, how can a traveler spend more intentionally? Again, go back to the tribal website.

go to destinationa of america dot com just doing a little bit of research you'd be surprised what you actually find when you ask the right questions so right questions being is it authentic is it tribal made and did you buy it direct from the artist because if it is and it it might be a higher price in a gateway city shop but they have their markup so if you know you're going to be visiting the steward indian school

and there's an artist that also sells in the Reno airport, save your money and go to the Stuart Indian School and buy direct. Sometimes there's not that opportunity. The takeaway there is make sure it's authentic and make sure it was bought, purchased directly from the native artists themselves.

Brian Jewell (29:30.472)
Yeah. Also a good tour operator partner on the ground should probably be able to tell you, Hey, listen, if you, if you really want to buy some great native artwork, the place we're going three days from now is the place to do it rather than, you know, blowing the opportunity in the gateway.

Dawnielle Tehama (29:43.969)
Right, right. Yeah, exactly.

Brian Jewell (29:48.542)
Yeah, excellent. All right, well, tell us what you are up to at the association and what some of the projects you're working on for the future are.

Dawnielle Tehama (29:58.291)
how much time do I have left? We actually have, we have a lot that we're working on right now. So AIT, American Indigenous Tourism, right now we're really focused on making sure Indigenous communities have the tools and the training and the visibility to thrive in this economy. Tourism in general, you know, like, I'm not sure if you mentioned this at the top of the hour, but I've been in this industry for over 20 years.

Brian Jewell (30:00.543)
Ha

Dawnielle Tehama (30:25.594)
So I've seen those ebb and flow times, but the visibility to thrive in this economy right now on our own terms is where we're kind of branching off and becoming this cultural Mecca, right? And it can, again, it can be very lucrative for our operators and our guides and our receptives globally. So we're rolling out the original original accreditation program into next year, which

for our tour operators means if you see this mark, it is an authentic indigenous owned product. Whether that's a tour, a guided tour, an artist, an event, when you see this mark, it's already been rolled out in Canada very successfully for over two years now, this program, and Maori tourism is also rolling it out. So this is a multinational global mark of accreditation. It will help the traveler also identify

truly authentic indigenous experiences. And the goal is a future where indigenous tourism is not just a niche, it's central to how America understands itself, right? And globally, right? There's indigenous communities around the world. But for us, how America understands itself from the cultural perspective, people who maybe want to visit a city who have been there, done that, they've done all the things, but they want something new. Well, this is a fresh perspective and it's told from an authentic center.

So that's one thing we're really focused on. We're also focused on continuing to just educate and enrich our partners as well as our communities on, you know, sustainable funding, sustainable farming, agritourism, regenerative travel, what these things mean for people who are seeking authentic connection to the land and to themselves and to each other. This is a very, very hot topic right now.

but it's something that's ingrained in Indigenous communities worldwide.

Brian Jewell (32:23.678)
Yeah, that's excellent. We will definitely link to the website in the show notes, but one more time in case people need to hear it, what's the best way for them to find the association and to find you?

Dawnielle Tehama (32:32.271)
Well, for us, we are americanindigenistourism.org or destinationnativeamerica.com.

Brian Jewell (32:42.516)
Yeah, excellent. And people can find you on LinkedIn.

Dawnielle Tehama (32:46.624)
Absolutely, Danielle Tehima.

Brian Jewell (32:49.322)
Well, before we let you go, we have some questions we ask everybody and they're just for fun. So no pressure. You can answer off the top of your head. When you book travel, are you choosing window seats or aisle seats?

Dawnielle Tehama (33:00.847)
I'll all the way I'll.

Brian Jewell (33:03.014)
I am with you, I just can't be pinned in.

What is one thing in your carry-on that you wouldn't travel without?

Dawnielle Tehama (33:13.275)
Believe it or not, because I'm on the road quite extensively, my white noise machine. I'm not a good night's sleep, Brian. You got to have a good night's sleep no matter where you are. And if you're jumping around time zones and you're not used to the noise because my community is very quiet. If I hear sirens at night, I'm going to be up all night. So I have to have my white noise machine.

Brian Jewell (33:17.866)
really?

Brian Jewell (33:33.842)
Yeah, that's smart. So if you had a free airline pass in a week with nothing else to do, where would you be headed next?

Dawnielle Tehama (33:42.723)
No, that's a hard one. That's a really hard one. Am I going by myself?

Brian Jewell (33:44.83)
Yeah, I know.

For this question,

Dawnielle Tehama (33:50.549)
Okay. If I'm going by myself, I would be heading to Karpathos Greece, which is probably one of the furthest islands from Athens, but it actually reminds me a lot of our indigenous communities in the desert Southwest. And they speak a mix of modern and ancient Greek, and they're just very wholesome people and a very traditional island.

Brian Jewell (34:12.958)
Yeah. Wow, that's wonderful. So our last question is, what is one thing you have seen or done on the road that you wish you could go back and experience again with somebody you love?

Dawnielle Tehama (34:24.515)
What haven't I done on the road by myself that I wish my family would do that?

Brian Jewell (34:27.621)
Ha ha!

Dawnielle Tehama (34:33.015)
You know, I would have to say it's kind of a toss up between, and I used to work for Grand Canyon's West Rim, which is Wallop I owned and operated. It's the only portion of the Grand Canyon that's under tribal oversight. Being on the skywalk, which if you don't know is that glass bottom bridge that juts over the Grand Canyon. Being on the skywalk as the sun comes up and just the peace and the serenity and the quiet.

of the desert southwest as the colors change and just the silence and the solitude and that vastness. Last time I saw that was 15 years ago and I can't unsee it and I can't not crave that quiet. But again, similar forest bathing in Slovenia. I would love to go back and...

I guess craving the outdoors and craving connection to nature is kind of my MO.

Brian Jewell (35:33.682)
Yeah, and sharing it with some special people. Yeah, that's amazing. Donyell, it's been a delight. Thank you so much for joining us.

Dawnielle Tehama (35:36.035)
Yes.

Dawnielle Tehama (35:41.337)
Thank you for having me today.

Brian Jewell (35:45.747)
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